Adam Curry: podcasting 2.0 for December 1 2023, episode 157
Five Hello everybody, welcome to podcasting 2.0 Your weekly board
meeting everything that's going on in podcasting. We are the
current state of the art. This is the only boardroom that skips
the ads for you automatically. Yes, everything happening in
podcast index.org with a namespace and podcast index dot
social. I'm Adam curry here the heart of the Texas Hill Country
out in Alabama, the man who can roll your pod smoother and
flatter than anyone say hello to my friend on the other end.
Ladies and gentlemen, Mr. Dave Jones. I'm rolling. We're
rolling in pod. Our feed now has a pod roll.
Dave Jones: Oh, you put one in? Well, I
Adam Curry: Stephen B added it to sovereign feeds. And I just
added it and I need to ask you if because I put in of course, I
put in our prep shows which is new media show and podcast
weekly review. I put in no way no agenda since you know it's a
big promoter of the podcasting tomorrow. Do you have any,
anything you'd like on the pod roll?
Dave Jones: Gosh, I have lots of things I would like on the I
Adam Curry: mean, I can put in a million it just hit Add and keep
and you know what's cool about it. You hit Add and it looks up
in the end. I just love these little things. It looks up in
the index. Just type in the podcast name it shows up you
click Done. You don't have to do anything with RSS feeds. You
just look it up. Click on it done.
Dave Jones: It's beautiful. Well, let me look let me go
inspect the said pod roll and see what see what you got in
there. You got like
Adam Curry: looking at our feed. Yeah, we're gonna feed that
should be in the feed. I put it in the feed.
Dave Jones: Sorry, I just saw that. I like looking in the feed
every now and then because it's entertaining. Because you do
things in here that I don't know about. Like what did I do? Like?
Well, you did you have these blocks in here. Oh block. Apple
block Spotify block Amazon.
Adam Curry: Yeah. How well did that work as you can tell, but
Apple just took our feet anyway. That really works. They don't
Dave Jones: even honor their own block tag. So why would they
honor anybody? Yes, true. I don't see the pod roll where?
Oh, wait.
Adam Curry: Thanks, Steven. B. You are You are the man you are
the master you are the man I love you
Dave Jones: bro knows yet. Yeah, he only got three and then we
need to base that up. Yeah,
Adam Curry: I mean, he didn't eat beef. Beef. Shake that up.
Dave Jones: I mean, like, at least me know. What's the music
and music show? Like?
Adam Curry: Oh, yeah, this grandpa hadn't even hadn't even
considered that. I mean, I could put all my shows in there but I
put three in I figured you might have one but if you want me to
add Bookstagram ball Okay, since you twist my arm
Dave Jones: yet, but this your grandma wants to get started. Go
to pod roll.
Adam Curry: Oh, second. Oh, that show in front needs to go to are
you doing
Dave Jones: this live? Are you adding this line? He's sticking
it in LA Can I
Adam Curry: do that? Baby. I'm sticking it in live. Although
that's dangerous. Something just happened here. Which is not
good. I don't know. Yeah. Come on, man. Come on. Let me do it.
sink in the feed sink in the feed show info pod roll. There
it is three, add podcast, boom. Booster. Booster. We're gonna
send
Dave Jones: her another it's gonna web hook it and you're
gonna send another live to everybody, which is fine,
because you just get is gonna be like, everyone's gonna get
double notified. Okay, so really seriously, you need to listen to
this. Okay, that
Adam Curry: double notification everybody.
Dave Jones: Let me refresh in there, that there. That's what a
beautiful
Adam Curry: system.
Dave Jones: Update a feed and it actually updated. Yes.
Adam Curry: I want to get I want to thank the company ADIA for
making all podcasts now value for value. I think that's
fantastic. Great job.
Dave Jones: I have no idea what you're talking about, oh,
Adam Curry: audio is an app that uses AI. And when you subscribe
to a podcast it it downloads the episode, then it uses AI to look
for the ads and removes them for you. Which is all this which,
which makes every single podcast value for value. Because if you
come to the party guess I mean if you if you I mean if you want
to support the podcast, you either don't use the audio app
and listen to the ads or you don't care and you just haven't
blocked it out. I mean, it's value for value. It's the same
thing.
Dave Jones: It is I didn't know what the effort didn't realize
what the name of this thing was. But that's
Adam Curry: not the name of the app the the name But the app is
something else. I think I actually got the app that works
as advertised. And so a couple things about this. First of what
is the name of this app? What isn't? I
Dave Jones: mean, wait, you did my understanding was they did
not. They're not doing this on podcast yet. They're only there
are they're only doing it on like radio.
Adam Curry: Yes. You've worked on the radio stuff. Correct.
Okay. All right. Well, that was your test. That was my test.
Well, there's a couple things with this app. So just briefly
on this app, which now I can't read, is it called Audio
missing? Look at my fader, I thought it was called faders. In
a fader. Yeah. Maybe fade with a DI D, our fader. So first, I
just want to say they have music shows in there. I'd like to know
how you do that. fader? How are you playing licensed music in
shows on your app? I'd like to know that right off the bat.
Unknown: I shows like these
Adam Curry: are they have they have they could have? Well, they
have something called Music casts. Earlier name the thought
long and hard about it. Yeah, they have music casts. And they
have DJs plans, licensed music. I would love to know how they do
that. They got 90s. They got all kinds of stuff. So I'd really
like to know how you're paying for the rights on that. But if
there's anything wrong with this company, and I'm this app is
that I don't understand how they're doing. I'd like to know
that. I completely adore the fact that they have proven that
you cannot monetize the network. This and this is no different. I
have three apps here. Regular good old fashioned podcast apps,
who allowed me to set a number of minutes to skip at the
beginning of each podcast. It's this is not new. Just the fact
that it's you know, I guess AI is new.
Dave Jones: What do I hear? Sorry, that's that was tapped
on. Evidently, there's they're playing ice baby right now.
Adam Curry: I don't know how they do that. Yes.
Dave Jones: Yeah, good. But this this
Adam Curry: is this is a very important development, because
it shows that the end is here. There's been this unwritten
agreement which by the way, all the time by I have to jump on
Twitter, and defend podcast apps. Sam Sethi says I've set
the time to 6:25am. local time. No, I haven't.
Dave Jones: In sovereignty,
Adam Curry: I have I said it with a live Yeah, I said it
properly. She talking about is
Dave Jones: 12. One 625. Let me double check. 000 time, it's 625
UTC is what it said to her and yeah,
Adam Curry: so isn't that correct? Yeah. Okay. Anyway.
This was inevitable. It's just, um, I had this conversation I
was being interviewed this morning, about advertising
itself. The advertising is a race to the bottom, always on
the internet, just looking banner ads, look at every other
CPM. Because ultimately, there's no scarcity. There's no
limitation on how many ads can run. So it's always going to run
down to the lowest possible price. Always. And, and, you
know, it's like the all the conversations now. Well, we all
know, we kind of skipped over him. So these guys just making
it easy. Yes. Yes, that's right. That's right. This is for ad
inserts. You know, I think if you do something in the show,
we're sponsored by that. That seems to be the only thing that
will work. And I've always thought that was a good idea.
But I built a whole company trying to do that and still
couldn't make it work.
Dave Jones: If you can insert something somebody else can
uninstall can can extract. Yeah, exactly. What's the opposite of
insert? decirte somebody else can rip that out. Insert.
Retract? Retract. Yeah, you can withdraw. Yes. That's so I had
an interesting advertising. Sort of week this week. Oh. Well, I
started. Here's a general problem I'm facing is that I've
got so many podcasts. I can't listen to them all.
Adam Curry: I mean, I'm here here. Yeah.
Dave Jones: I got 20 hours of podcast dropping in my play in
my podcast app a week and of what's out, maybe get out of
control. It's out of control. We are absolutely responsible for
you know, with these two hour shows that we do weird when we
are aggressive.
Adam Curry: Good work. Good work, good work.
Dave Jones: But like I've got so much I can't listen to it. So
I've been so behind on like pod, pod news weekly review and all
these like, I'm not just so far behind. So I'm like, Okay, I'm
gonna catch up. And, and I was listening to last week's show of
pod news weekly review. And they interviewed Lisa Jacobs from,
like, add results or something like that. I get all these names
mixed up. Yeah. Sounds right. Okay, so I just want I just want
to start this by saying this is not an attack on Lisa at all.
I'm sure she's a she's a fine lady, but the advertising agency
people. And this also includes Spotify. In a lady interviewed
on the most recent,
Adam Curry: you mentioned when she talks like this.
Dave Jones: No, no, no, that's actually not it. Oh, get a
decent microphone. Oh, my gosh. The audio is
Adam Curry: that yes, there's that.
Dave Jones: So you're you are the brand. You are the
representative of an advertising agency that's focused on
podcasting. And you sound like you're in can? Yeah, yes. You
sound horrible. Like, I don't understand how they let that
out. Microphones are not expensive. You should be handed
a decent microphone and audio interface is the day that you
sign up for this job.
Adam Curry: A pod my pod mic is all you need. It's got the
processing you can stick your headphones and good to go. It's
Dave Jones: perfect. The number of people I hear from
advertising agencies and I listen to things like media
roundtable which is Oxford road advertising agency now, they all
sound horrible. They sound like their own the built in MacBook
Air, Mike, it's it's so bad. Well, we've
Adam Curry: had guests on this show where we had to go like
what's wrong with you? Yeah, media Roundtable. I'm not so
sure. Yeah. What's what really helped me? Don't just just don't
do it. No, no, no, no, what helped me I got to subscribe to
the media roundtable. I just I just started using a different
app. I just, I just started using podcast guru and started
from from scratch. It's like, what do I really need? What do I
bring? Because I've got I mean, I have to. I mean, I think I've
turned the downloads off on pod verse and fountain. I also will
have I think I've all on loaded pretty much except for cast
thematic because I'm graphing OS, but have everything else.
And
Dave Jones: you did the dust off and nuke it from orbit strategy.
Adam Curry: Is that what that is dust off and nuke it? Well,
that's a reference
Dave Jones: to aliens, the movie Aliens. Use nuke your whole
playlist and start over? Well,
Adam Curry: so obviously I have my I have backups with my OPML
and my you know, I can export the OPML. But I just look I look
deep inside my soul and said, What do I want to listen to? Oh,
it's Tuesday. That means my hatless in which I would have to
say for some odd reason the pivot podcast is it's religious
for me. I never missed the visit pop pivot podcast. I mean, I
might drop out if the guests they have at the end is not
interesting, but that happens so rarely. And it's because I
disagree with pretty much everything they say that it's
good for my soul. I mean, I respect that I respect them. I
don't like him. I don't like what they say. I disagree, but I
respect him. And and they have good mics. So there's that. And
then the new media show I liked the new media show a lot of
always disappointed that I'm either not getting the pod ping
or no sound. Speaking of sound, I mean, there's been so many
problems with the sound. So usually that's a Wednesday and
around noon or one o'clock or something goes off. I'm always
delighted. Then I'll work out to that.
Dave Jones: What was your work? Are you spinning you still spin?
No, no, no, I'm
Adam Curry: free weights baby. Oh, you pumping, pumping pumping
iron? Oh, yeah. Yeah, no, you know that none of my clothes fit
me anymore. Because you're too big or too small. No, my chest
expanded.
Dave Jones: Because you ripped.
Adam Curry: I'm far from rips but also I stopped smoking over
exactly a year ago. Pretty much so. But but it's it's not that
I'm fat. It's just the working out. I mean, I knew what
happened. I see. My my my goal is the if Joe Rogan invited me
on again. I want to walk in I want to go curry What happened
to you?
Dave Jones: Give me your arm wrestling?
Adam Curry: I don't think so.
Dave Jones: You could stand easily to put on another 20
pounds
Adam Curry: that No, no, no, not you. You haven't seen me. I
Dave Jones: mean, I mean from the time I lost
Adam Curry: 205 Yeah, but you're six five When I was 189, so I
put on a t stand for six. Yeah, it was anyway, every morning
literally religiously because I walked the dog I say my morning
prayers. And then on the way back, I listened to pod News
Daily. That's it's perfect length. It's perfect in so many
ways. And I can also like the practice forgiveness
Dave Jones: base Ireland prayer,
Adam Curry: pretty much. Of course, pod news weekly review,
sometimes we'll come in late Thursday, which I did. But I
always try to listen to that. And I think that's pretty much
it me and then I have some other sporadic acts. But honestly,
there's there's not much time left for other things. You know,
I look forward to a drive into Austin, you know, from time to
time because like, oh yeah, I can listen to a couple of
things. And there is there is one type of podcast that can
listen to while I'm working and that's music podcast, so I'll
listen to the sidestream podcast or listen to homegrown hits.
I'll listen to it's a mood to mood you know listen to stuff
like that once in a while I put on lightning thrashes it's not
really my jam, but you know, I like to listen up beats is hello
I love salty crayon up beats is my favorite it's like the old
pirate radio days you know he's like literally like all right, I
got another song here this is brand new from dorsals pause for
like three seconds I love it isn't needed the needle needle
on the record. I love that it makes I Tina came up I was
cooking on the on the grill outside he says you're laughing
you're playing air guitar I'm listening to upbeats I buy low
sell to crayon so much. I know him personally it was a great
guy. And we because it just all this like it takes a while for
the song to start. That's always a good song and I play air
guitar and I wait for him to come back on. It's just it gives
me so much joy and I can listen to those anywhere while I'm
working even so I love doing that. And of course LM beats
just for just to listen to the top 100 habit to have a go
random I love that
Dave Jones: is the you know I'm I'm addicted. I'm addicted to
club random with Bill Maher. I mean, I never miss an episode
now. Oh, wow. That's not a hate. Listen. That's because because
he's got he's got interesting
Adam Curry: guests for sure. Yeah. And he's a he's a pretty,
Dave Jones: I mean, he has his moments but he's pretty he tries
to play it down the middle as much as he can he'll swerve you
know, but of course, like we all
Adam Curry: I'm always surprised by some how uneducated he is on
certain things like Bill Maher, did you not know that?
Dave Jones: That is so true. He did say something the other day
he said he was like Whoa, did that. Did you not know this?
Because he because he knows a lot. And then like how did how
did you not have this? This whole has you have this hole in
your knowledge? Yeah, but he had he had Margaret show. Do you
know comedian? Yeah. So you had her on as a guest.
Adam Curry: A couple of EPS where she been? I haven't seen
her in a long time.
Dave Jones: I don't really know. Evidently she's like, works all
the time. They work yeah. But um, he had her on. And I thought
I knew who she was. But I actually I made it through the
whole episode. The the first part of the episode is kind of
not my, how long are these things? A couple hours tasteful?
No, they're not. They're usually like an hour and a half. 15
Adam Curry: once a week or multiple times a week? Couple of
times a week. Oh,
Dave Jones: yeah. And but he like he had to take Candace
Owens on that was a fun one because they they battled and
then they would battle again. I'll bet ya had a big debate
about the moon landing. It
Adam Curry: was pretty funny. Now I gotta go listen to it. Oh,
you hadn't heard it. I was testing. That's fantastic. She
believer in
Dave Jones: I don't know what she really would say she was
kind of him hauling around. She wouldn't commit. But, so he had
Margaret's show on and I was like, you know, I think I think
I know who this is. And so I started looking up. Jump on
YouTube. And I look up Margaret Cho. And I was like, Huh, okay,
well, what is I haven't I don't know that I've ever seen her
stand up. So I've tried a couple of different versions. And I'll
say like Margaret Cho, stand up. And I hit that and it comes back
with of course it's got the shorts and all that stuff which
always skipped Yeah, roll down. PBR. You're on PBR.
Adam Curry: This is Yeah, this is a Pabst Blue Ribbon. acolytes
light. That's right.
Dave Jones: So she scroll down and I'm like, I'm like, Oh, this
is weird. And there's like some, some pretty sketchy thumbnails
of some sick stuff on here on YouTube on YouTube with me
looking at Margaret Cho stand up, keeps rolling.
Adam Curry: It turns out it's a porn move. It's like a position
doing a Barbie Margaret show. Hey, man, I'm doing a Margaret
Cho stand up. Oh, wow. That's a tough one. That's
Dave Jones: a version of the Margaret Cho. Yeah, the standard
variant. Yeah. So like, and then before I scroll down a little
further, and dude, I'm telling you, it went off the rails. It
was full on. Like, I had to close the browser fast because I
was afraid that that like, I was gonna get a knock on the door.
Wow, it was it was shocking. The type of porn is coming
Adam Curry: from a guy who rips a chair roosters head off with
his bare hands. So it was Shari Yeah. Yeah,
Dave Jones: it was scary. And I was it. I figured that all that
kind of stuff makes it onto these platforms at some point.
Adam Curry: Oh, no, it's it's in the algos. Dude, it was
Dave Jones: disgusting. And I mean, like, I don't know if this
was pedo. I don't know what this was. But I was like, I was like,
Oh my god. So in there's advertising against this?
Adam Curry: Oh, yeah. I had this same experience with with tick
tock, which I don't have the app. But I installed the app,
because apparently I was going viral for something. I was like,
Okay, I'll go take a look. And I opened the app right away, I get
one of those. Right away. First thing first install, boom. And
I'm like, nope, delete. I'm done. I'm good. Nope, no, thank
you. Unbelievable. And then we wonder what's wrong with our
young men in the world. And
Dave Jones: so this made me I had seen this, this article
headline earlier. So I went back and looked, and it was the I
think I sent it to you. Maybe it was the article about? Yeah, no,
I did, um, about the Google advertising network, the search
partner network, and how they monetize. They put ads against
all this horrible content. Yes, yeah. Now, of course, they they
go political and put Breitbart in their analysis. But if you
get past that part and actually dig into that report, it is like
Google is advertising against every type of dis. Oh, tasteful
porn, drugs, everything you can think of?
Adam Curry: That was from AD analytics. That's what that was
from. Yes. Yeah. That is.
Dave Jones: It's a very long report. But it is worth going
through because he sees he goes step by step. And shows you
examples of like, the F, like, it'll have a, a website for
like, you know, who knows, like ISIS. And there will be an FBI.
ad for a job opening right there on the ISIS page is your
artificial
Adam Curry: intelligence right there makes no sense. Or
Dave Jones: it'll be some like, hardcore porn thing. And
there'll be an ad, you know, right there for like, you know,
some TV show. He's like, so that this was the experience I had
with advertising this week, I was like you, this is the idea.
It rang a bell with me when you said what you said earlier?
About the like, the inventory, like draft to zero. I wonder if
some of this brand safety stuff is an attempt to artificially
artificially reduce at ad space to keep the CPMs from going? Oh,
Adam Curry: that's a good that's a very good point. It's still
not true. Because because you can still, you know, how, how
many ads do you want? You know, how much the how much inventory
Do you want? We just create more it'd be for every podcast
download, you download, you stop and we started could have a
different ad. I mean, it's, it's endless, but it will it will. It
will limit it to some degree. Yes. That's an interesting
angle. I don't even know if, if that's purposeful.
Dave Jones: Because you could say if you looked at at all the
digital ad space as a pie, and you say, Okay, well, we want the
bigger we have to preserve our section of pie or enlarge it
somehow. We need to the only way to do it is to reduce the
inventories do reduce the ad space. And what we definitely
want to get a twofer. Yeah. By taking it away from our
political competition or whatever that is. Yeah. But it
seems just in general, but of course brand safety doesn't. It
doesn't actually that is so
Adam Curry: interesting. You bring that up, because just this
afternoon, I was listening to my hatless and, and Professor Scott
Galloway, professor in marketing. He he said that, the
the end here's the sick thing about this Elan situation, is
that because of all these advertisers pull out, a smaller
advertiser will get a much larger return on investment for
the time being, because there's just because there's much less
ad dollars competing for the space.
Dave Jones: No, there you go. That's, that's almost
confirmation that yes, at least something to do. And
Adam Curry: I just don't know if it's purposeful. I know.
Dave Jones: It may be one of those things where it wasn't
purposeful at the beginning, but then they see a bump every time
and they keep doing it.
Adam Curry: Like yeah, yeah. That's very, that's an
interesting angle. So you're giving them a lot of credit? I
Dave Jones: am. The brand safety thing is so obviously, a red
herring. Even case in point is this. This on the media episode
that mean you texted about the other day? Oh, my
Adam Curry: goodness, I got five, five clips from that. No
agenda that was so unhinged people hearing things that are
not even there. It was great.
Dave Jones: It was like it was, I think it was a couple of days
ago was the Africa during the title of it was all about Trump.
And so it was like some body took. When future archaeologists
attempt to understand Trump derangement syndrome, this
episode of On the media will be their Rosetta Stone. That is,
it's like somebody took Trump derangement syndrome, distilled
it, purified it into liquid for 20
Adam Curry: minutes and put it into 20 minutes. It was in a
special episode no less.
Dave Jones: When you're high on liquid Trump derangement
syndrome. This is your favorite train. That's what it sounds
like. True in? Do you remember a single advertiser from that
episode?
Adam Curry: Well, I am. So I have pretty much eliminated
advertising for my life that I had used. I've used the piehole
for years. So I really between my piehole and brave browser,
really very little gets through, you know, graphene OS. So
there's much less stuff being tracked and trying to be
recommended to me through other arenas I get, I never see an ad
on Twitter that I like the ads on most of the podcasts. I've
listened to like, I've listened to the pivot ads, because I'm
very interested, who advertises and they have, I have to say,
for all the F bombs and all the racism that they espouse,
especially against white men. It's and Christian hates and all
this stuff, the or fear of God, I should say, because man,
they're afraid of God. The order your sky, daddy, they, they they
have apple. The funniest one is, you know, just show you how
corrupt they are morally corrupt without even knowing it. I'm not
going to accuse them. They have at Atlassian is advertising like
crazy. Of course, they're they're the award winning tech
show, being the tech news about Atlassian is how Confluence has
been hacked by the Chinese and all the military contractors are
freaking out. But of course, they can't talk about that, nor
will they ever when Atlassian is is advertising. You know, so I'm
always surprised, but also delightfully delighted by how
they are literally doing ads for Apple together. Now in the most
disingenuous way, Scott, what do you have on your Mac? Well, I
have numbers because you know, I need to know what's going on
with the numbers. I mean, it's numbers. The Karate is the
craziest Excel ever works. It's so bad. I about to do with
speech. I'm gonna use Keynote. No, you're not you're using
PowerPoint, don't lie. Don't lie. We all know we know you're
full of crap. But everybody I mean, advertising is so the
antithesis of value for value. Because it's, it's disruptive.
You know, it's it's interrupting your enjoyment. And that just
goes to show that people do not care about the podcast if they
don't listen to the ads It's really it's a it's a, it's a bad
ask, please listen to the ads to support us. Oh, my God, I mean,
all you have to do is say, send send me some some value, and
someone might send you 50 bucks. You know, that'll be the entire
run of that ad for a month. Besides why it's such a small
switch in your head to instead of saying please listen to the
ads, click on the the advertisers to saying Why don't
you support the show with whatever you think it's worth?
It's just it's it. The whole world has to move this way.
Unfortunately, Amazon and I gladly pay for for Amazon Prime
video, I gladly play for pay for Netflix. Then they have Hulu. I
have no cable anymore. I cut the cord on that there's nothing
there's no no cable in my life. So none of those ads, I don't
listen to radio. But now Amazon, they're moving towards the ad
this thing called free V. Sykes is that well, you're looking for
some show or some things that oh, the show was right here. Oh,
it's free v. So it has ads. But I don't see a way for me to just
let me have to pay extra for this, I'll pay extra for it.
They don't get that opportunity. It's so it's so short sighted.
And then the whole world will have to move towards either
straight up subscription. Which some things are just worth
subscribing to. I think everything's and I don't have
any subscriptions that way. But some and you know, we know that
this streaming model doesn't work because they're all losing
money. So that's not working to ultimately, you kind of gotta
move towards a value for value model. Then if you're not
skipping the ads, that's value for value. View our even if you
don't care, you are showing value by listening to an ad. But
what a what a what a horrible thing instead of hey, love me,
help me. It's love me. Take some beatings.
Dave Jones: Yeah. Well, yeah, the that the fader thing. I'm
like you it just, it was inevitable. I mean, come on
everybody. This is we could all sit down for a little while this
is, I mean, even before AI, this before AI, lots of people had
lots of ways that they had come up with to do this exact thing.
Adam Curry: How about a DVR bit started with DVRs? Like, oh, I
recorded the show, or let's walk, let's start watching the
show at five after the hour. So when the ad comes on, I can fast
forward through it. Everyone's done that it's a broken model is
some of it still works. I mean, I'm not against commerce and
advertising. It just doesn't seem to be working anymore. When
it's when you're in this environment. I
Dave Jones: think that's the difference. Like the advertising
model. It all it only it only worked up into the point. Up
until the point where there was a digital were became digital.
Yeah. TiVo? Yeah, the digital ecosystem. And the advertising
model. Just they just don't work together.
Adam Curry: Or even there's VHS. I mean, that's when it really
started. You
Dave Jones: as soon as you can control in an automated way.
What the what the content is? It's just it's your it's a
complete collapse. Yeah. And you can't stop it because it just
the same way that you can't stop. You know, that you can
spam filter. I mean, think about it that way. spam filtering is
just weeding out advertising.
Adam Curry: Yeah. Thank you. It's exactly what it is. When
Dave Jones: I don't want to, I want to use an email, my email.
But I don't want to see ads for Viagra. So I spam filter because
we already have a subscription. And this is just not smart.
That's just dumb advertising. It's called Pfizer blue.
Adam Curry: Is that the new thing? Pfizer blue? Is that what
it's called? The dollars a
Dave Jones: month you get out? Yes. I agree.
Adam Curry: That's a deal. ffice eyes are
Dave Jones: blue. You get the blue check. The blue V like the
so this is have been happening for you. Let me go a little bit
further than that on that on ad blocking. Because ad ad
blocking. I don't for most most people's interaction with ad
blockers is that they don't like seeing a bunch of ads on the
internet when they browse so they install an ad blocker.
That's like the normal view and you user you know what control
like a rent roll control residential? Yeah, that's that's
sort of everybody's typical interaction. But there's a
there's another side to this, that it people see in the
enterprise. And for us adver adblocking is not primarily a
thing about convenience or entertainment or whatever. It's
a safety issue. Yes. So we we deploy as most enterprises do,
pretty much as a standard, we deploy some level of Ad blocking
across the board in a defensive posture. Because digital
advertising like banner ads became malicious. Long ago, they
did they did, you would you would go to a website, a
JavaScript ad would would would pop your machine and you're
compromised. So the enterprise world took a defensive stance
against advertising many years ago, and that has persisted and
even gotten stronger. So a lot, most, most, most enterprise
level, it will do things like, like you said, like pot pie
holing, but it's you know, it's at the firewall level, that will
firewall it, they'll host name list it, they will put in
browser ad blocker extensions, they have multiple like is
multiple layers of advertising blocking, as a to reduce their
attack surface. And you this level of tech and commitment to
the process of Ad blocking, will norm will inevitably flow
downhill into the rest of of digital media. Audio comes next,
even though audio has you could you can say for sure that audio
has less of an attack vector on the ad front than something like
a browser ad does. But it's not zero. So like you, you could,
you could, so we all know stage fright, and the stage fright
vulnerabilities from Android Wear media where certain types
of media get played, and it would pop your phone that you
this stuff is coming. And it's coming from different angles.
It's not just I guess what I'm trying to say is, when you look
at people using ad blockers, or trying to strip ads from
content, it's not always just about this greedy sob trying to
get something for free. There are other motivations involved.
Adam Curry: True, and I and I'm old enough to remember the first
ad blockers popping up in web browsers. Adblock I think, and I
remember I was in the advertising space at the time.
And not not with with web ads, per se, but I had commercial
clients who were involved in a lot of this. And you know, that
the industry got together and well we have to deal with they
had whitelisting acceptable ads, you know, quote unquote,
acceptable ads, all this stuff. It never works. It none of it
has ever worked. It never will. It's just, it's not going to
happen. Because ultimately, the advertising methodology of
interruption is anti human. It's just it's anti human. Mm.
Moreover, because advertising is tailored towards making
difference done well towards making you open and susceptible
for the ad. At the moment it comes if it's really done well.
And now the paywall thing is different. And I think that's
also anti human. You know, it's like, oh, wow, I want to read
this article. Click paywall. Do you have a choice right there.
Now it's like, do I use some tools I might have? Do I just
that wasn't that important. I'm not going to look at it. And I
would posit that if you made it frictionless for someone to say,
oh, you know, that was kind of cool. Thanks for giving me that
I'm gonna pay you 10 SATs or whatever. I would posit that
ultimately that will be better for you than any other
methodology in the long run as we go down this hill, which just
is a race to the bottom it it is has always been that way. You
know, we had you remember when cassettes came out and then the
mom was stealing music so how they do it? They put $1 on the
price of blank cassettes that went to the music industry that
didn't last they want to do the same thing with hard drives.
Dave Jones: I don't remember that. Oh, yeah. When
Adam Curry: I think that was when Napster was around
Dave Jones: Yep. They want to they wanted to have a tax on
hard hard drives.
Adam Curry: Yeah, cuz you were storing your music on it. Yeah,
I bet a bit that actually musi was it. Hard Drive music.
Dave Jones: I didn't remember that about the cassette tapes.
Adam Curry: Oh, yeah. Oh, all blank media had be private copy
levy There you go. Copy lead also known as blank media tax
government mandated scheme in which a special tax or Levy,
this charge on purchase of recordable media history Let me
see your Europe of course European have they had that? In
Belgium Oh well, I guess it hasn't gone away entirely in
Belgium a fee is charged on both blank media and recording
equipment, which is passed on to Ovie Bell, which is in charge of
distributing the funds as of February 120 10. So I don't know
if it's still around mp3 mp4 players how to tax TV Hi Fi
combined DVD writer video recorder multifunctional DVD.
This has been around for a long time.
Dave Jones: I had no this is a revelation to even
Adam Curry: have oh, yeah, in Finland. It's four euros for
memory cards up to five or memory devices up to 512
megabytes. Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah.
Dave Jones: So do the phone like, do phone manufacturers
also pay this like an iPhone or an Android device or Lord knows,
Adam Curry: I don't even know if it's still in play. But this,
this was one of the solutions. I don't think these prices are in
play, because you can get for 36 euros, you can get a lot more
than that kind of space these days. I mean, cases the cost of
what they are. But there's always been, you know, so you
you devolve to DRM, which has its own drawbacks. All I can say
is, from my own 16 years of experience, value for value
works, that it is not designed, or even humane to be something
that works for everybody, which is the antithesis of what the
promise is from Silicon Valley. Get a camera, you'll make money.
You're a YouTuber, we not every not every podcast or product is
designed to have a mass audience that will make you livable wage
1000 people who care a lot about what you're doing in whatever
community you're in, and actually may make your life
sustainable. This is the promise of value for value. But the
promise is just not for everybody. You may be doing a
great podcast, but no one cares, because it's not for anybody
else. But you know, it's just no,
Dave Jones: no, yeah, I can I can confidently say that. A
podcast like this, which is a podcast about this a podcast
about not just this is not a podcast about podcasting. This
is a podcast about something very specific, very. The Bucha
is a boy a one single open source project within
podcasting. I mean, that is niche upon niche upon niche,
there is no way that this show will ever be able to provide us
a living wage is just not it's just not going to happen. So
that's not Yeah, you're right. I mean, these if you if you have a
podcast about you know about random subject a, there's a
likelihood that is just not going to have you're not going
to be able to do a living wage out of it. I mean, value for
value is going to be just as successful to you as best
advertising. More
Adam Curry: successful, I think, yeah, at
Dave Jones: least
Adam Curry: if you if you're looking at this podcast,
according to OP three dot dev in the last 30 days, how many
downloads Do you think we've had? What do you think?
Dave Jones: For the like the last episode,
Adam Curry: not in the last 30 days?
Dave Jones: How many downloads? Yeah. Oh, I'm gonna say to
10,000 5694
Adam Curry: this year. Yeah. As in November, our unique audience
was 5458. And I just use these numbers because that's the best
numbers we got. Is that op three? That's op three. Yeah.
Yes.
Dave Jones: That that these numbers are coming down, man,
that all yes, that are going on. These numbers are hilariously
coming down. Because we were at 13,000. I know. We were two
months. We're knocking it out of the park. But this was probably
the true number the whole time, you know, or something closer to
it. This is funny, man. This whole thing is just the
advertising and podcasting. It's just so distasteful to me, is so
distasteful. It's I'm gonna have to stop listening to this stuff.
Like these all these different shows about advertising and
stuff like that. They just they just, they're gross. They're
slimy. They'll like it. Well,
Adam Curry: I Okay. I won't go that far because I just I've
been in this business. I understand it. I ended Stand up
much better than people may even give me credit for. I left the
business on purpose, and took a huge leap to change my life. And
it's done more than just change. My Media has changed my life.
It's how I live my life. And I'm just the money router. You know,
it's like, I'm giving away money left and right. Oh, you got to
open source project, boom. Oh, you mean next cloud? Yeah, I use
all the time. And if they remind me somewhere, oh, yeah, I got to
support you, boom. I'm doing this all the time.
Dave Jones: I'm like, the only guy I know that pays for signal.
No, I
Adam Curry: donated a signal. Sure, sure. Of course, of
course, you got to otherwise one day, it'll go away. It goes
away. That's right. And then finally, you know that now that
Amazon Web Services is charging for public ipv4 addresses. ipv6
is no but ipv6 is here. It's it's going to change things.
It's going to change all of this. And I just feel bad for
people who desperately hold on to this stuff. The
Dave Jones: the pipe, the reason I say it's slimy is because the
podcast advertising is, is what is driving at 90 miles an hour.
And there's a cliff about Yeah, often the distance and it's just
heading straight for it. And the whole time up into the very last
moment, when the front wheels go an inch off into the to, you
know, to space, they're going to continue to tell everybody that
revenues up revenues up, revenue is up, we got better targeting,
we got this, we got that. And then you're going to just be
like the, you know, the coyote, you should be falling. It's
headed towards the bottom of the, you know, of the value of
the beaut, or whatever.
Adam Curry: And then, you know, while we're on this, and I'm
pretty sure this started on noster. But um, I won't blame
them per se, is zapped for zap vertising was, Oh, wow. So these
are companies that will get your lightning address. You know,
like,
Dave Jones: this is what Sam was? Yes. So which of
Adam Curry: course is Bo you get it right off of nostre. That's
the easiest way. You know, this is what Al B and and fountain
mio requested. And we changed in the namespace so I can have you
know, adam@fountain.fm. So now, all of that's being trolled.
But, of course, as being scraped out of feeds, I'm sure but the
easiest place because people are using it actively this way. With
Ellen URL pay is noster. And so now people are receiving, you
know, one to five sat payments with an ad in it.
Dave Jones: That think that's great. I mean, all day long,
Adam Curry: I think I think it shows that. You know, in a way
it shows that noster and even the Lightning Network are
solutions. Looking for problems? To make any sense.
Dave Jones: Yeah,
Adam Curry: I mean, this This to me is just it's gotten so bad.
That now all that your noster zap thing is good for is to
receive SMS advertising, spam, spam, spam, spam, spam, as bad.
Now, you know, everyone's going to have to now I'm with you to a
degree on like, well, if you're going to send me 1000 SATs make
it more interesting. But you know, now we want us to go build
filtering for that. So it's still intrusive,
Dave Jones: but depends on how much you're you know, it depends
on how much you're worth. I mean, if you if you look at my
you know, look, I can look off into the future on this thing
and say, Okay, well, somebody sees our show sees our pod roll
with various shows in it. They look at our mp3 which is public.
And they say okay, well this do these people have this issue has
5000 sat 5000 downloads they have there, they seem to align
well. I'm going to I'm going to spam them with with some with
some boost and try to get me to try to get mentioned on the show
and for our end we're going to just going to pump in our our
advertisements and then maybe even not a mention on the show
but since the boost and become public. The like, I don't know I
could see this as being sort of fun. It's almost like an
automated what would you call that like a, like an automated
way to have your ad pop up. It's like programmatic ads. But but
you pay to get into it. And it's like, nobody blocks it. It just
comes right in there. Well, you have to pay a decent ml you, you
set thresholds. And that's
Adam Curry: that that's what's missing. Yeah. And I run my own
node, I get nose advertising, but I don't have a single one.
Single
Dave Jones: Why have any?
Adam Curry: I haven't looked. I don't even think I have any on
Alby. And before, I only have one Albion, one block these
days. But you know what, now now, we do need filtering for
that, and I love helipad, because helipad will just won't
show it to me. If it's not in a TLV record. I'm not going to see
it. It's just I don't know.
Dave Jones: It's like this is this is all floundering is what
this? Yeah,
Adam Curry: that's okay. There's there's a good term floundering.
It's just floundering. Hey, I had an idea. This may be a weird
thought. Because again, you know, YouTube, the Doom podcast
is great. Is it weird of me to think that the even if it's HTML
embedded HTML code, is that wrong? As an enclosure on a
feed?
Dave Jones: An HTML enclosure?
Adam Curry: Yeah, like an embed code. So. So instead of fighting
YouTube, which I don't really care, but if you want to be on
YouTube, so you know, the way I wanted to seek where there's
zagging, So YouTube is saying, Give us all your RSS belong to
us. And we're going to, we're going to ingest it and there's
no and then once we have it, screw your RSS entry. We have
it. Okay, now, if I just wanted to put my YouTube video into my
RSS feed as an enclosure, does it necessarily mean an enclosure
can be a PDF and enclosure can be an mp3 and an M, an mp4? It
can be all kinds of different downloadable media
Dave Jones: is it can be anything with a MIME type.
Adam Curry: So could it be just an embeddable YouTube code that
just pops up within the app? Because the app says, Oh, this
is a YouTube? I mean, does it have to use? You understand what
I'm saying? Like the HTML
Dave Jones: like that you're talking about when you get one
of those HTML fragments? Yeah.
Adam Curry: Yeah. Like a web, a web clip, a web snippet? Because
the only reason why YouTube wins at this game is because of all
the obvious things they solved, which is a compatibility across
all browsers, and storage and bandwidth. So why wouldn't we
just you know, because I still want my metadata around it.
What's wrong with embedding a YouTube video making a YouTube
video and enclosure? Easy for apps to understand?
Dave Jones: Yeah, they would just spawn a WebView to show it.
Yeah. It's,
Adam Curry: I mean, I have no religious, you know, like, any,
any RSS versus downloadable media. reason to not think
that's legal. From a technical standpoint. No,
Dave Jones: I mean, it's totally laid out the only thing that
they could do only thing that YouTube could do would be they
could begin to block a showing it based on the referrer header.
Yeah, well, of course, we're not gonna allow this, but I mean,
that's, that's a cat and mouse game. Yeah.
Adam Curry: I mean, you can get around that eventually. And you
know, and sometimes, yeah, I mean, would there be a course
issue may be I don't know. I'm just throwing out some terms. I
have no idea what they mean. I just hit me. It's like, you
know, YouTube is a YouTube music. Although James Cridland
loves it. He says a pretty it's a pretty good podcast that what
if I just want my podcast app, but I just want to add Theo,
Vons YouTube video feed, and he just creates a feed is called
Theo Vaughn's YouTube video feed. And he puts him the embed
links as the enclosure or something like that. And then my
podcast app, which I know do all my podcast stuff with, just as
Oh, this is a YouTube video. Boom, I'll, I'll display it.
Dave Jones: Yes, yeah. I mean, I was still say, why wouldn't
because I think I think we're
Adam Curry: in this weird space. We're being complicated about
them being the app. No, they're just the storage in the end the
bandwidth people. That just because it's just because it's a
you know, it's streams like I stream all my NP threes. I mean,
yeah. Will you be able to view it as a download? Maybe I mean,
you can get there's lots of apps that that help you download the
actual video from YouTube maybe can implement that.
Dave Jones: Yeah, it would. So yeah, there's like as far as
violating any specs. It doesn't, right? No, no, no, not at all.
Because we, we used to do this in the freedom controller where
we would do exactly as enclosures, we would put HTML,
yes, enclosures. And so then the HTML, the enclosure, when the
when the, when the news river saw the HTML enclosure, it would
include it as a as, as a embed in the post. And
Adam Curry: I will, I'm willing to bet with you, which I won't,
but I'm willing to bet that YouTube would once YouTube sees,
oh, you know, everyone's using our YouTube videos, which they
can easily put an ad in front of if they want to. I mean, you
can't really stop that per se, although you could. But once
it's embedded, I mean, they could choose the route, they
could choose the route of no will block all podcast apps. I
have a feeling they might say, well, who cares? It's more
distribution for us.
Dave Jones: Yeah, I mean, they don't really block anything
nowadays. Do they?
Adam Curry: Know the only thing I get is like, you can't know
this. The owner won't let you view this as an embedded video,
which is an owner setting. But I think everything else embedded
anywhere, just play it plays on Mastodon, the history, plenty of
plenty of people put that. So why wouldn't we just have that?
I mean, let's not be jihadist about this, you know, it's like
let's turn it around, turn that frown upside down. Make your
YouTube make your YouTube channel or whatever, just make
turn that into into your your, your your hosting company for
your videos, then hosting companies. I'm going to exclude
some, for obvious reasons. But that's really the only reason
Oh, yes. Or they have a great recommendation engine. Okay, as
long as you keep feeding it, but most people subscribe to
podcasts because you heard about it from somebody else, or it's
in your pod roll, which we now have. So how would I go about
doing that? Can I just create a feed? And how do we do that with
the freedom controller? We just put it in as enclosure and then
the freedom controller knew how to read it. Yeah,
Dave Jones: so the way the freedom controller did this was
it would you have when you saved an article, you if you were on a
YouTube video, you would say even in you chose to save that
article in your database in your in your archive, the or you
chose to microblogging, but back to your micro blog. Whichever
way you did it, it would pull the embed code for that YouTube
video out here you go included as the enclosure with a with a
content type of text slash HTML. And so then when it comes back,
the when you see it in your, in your newsfeed on the freedom
controller page, when you saw it in your newsfeed, that post
would just be the video, it would just be the embed. So
you're seeing embeddable YouTube videos in your just in your
feed, and you just click play, you never actually leave that
page and go to YouTube. So
Adam Curry: how does this work with peer tube? When when you
get a peer tube? Isn't it exactly the same thing?
Dave Jones: Peer tube, peer tube has native support for
podcasting 2.0 alternating closures. And so what's the MIME
type? The MIME type for it is HLS.
Adam Curry: Okay, right. Gotcha is now. Okay, while we're on
this. So let's say new media show goes live. And I have an
option, maybe it's a third feed, and the option is the live
YouTube feed. But I can still stream my sets per minute to
them, I can still boost them. I'm just getting the I'm just
getting the stream from YouTube. I'm telling you, we've been
looking at this all wrong. We need to turn it upside down and
say thank you very much YouTube. That's great. Now the cool thing
is if you feed them your RSS feed and then it comes back into
your feed as a as an RSS enclosure that with recursion
but you basically have a feed that feeds YouTube you know you
get something about this tells me been looking at it all wrong.
And embrace embrace the free hosting company that is YouTube
Dave Jones: as well. This is exactly what people did to
SoundCloud and archive.org do to just upload your Why don't you
just upload your stuff to there right
Adam Curry: that's right. Yeah, but as we get closer Yes. And
people still do that. I think for
Dave Jones: Yeah, for sure that I don't know how you can get I
don't know what the street if they Do HLS or whatever he gets
some sort of native type of thing? I don't care, just the
Adam Curry: embedded player. Yeah, I don't care that I have
to start it by clicking on it or tapping on it. That's fine. As
long as long as I can, as long as I can stream SATs. Thank you
very much YouTube for the free bandwidth and free hosting.
Dave Jones: I agree. Yes. This is a good idea. I like this. It
was
Adam Curry: it just hit me. It's like why are we fighting these
guys? Why do we have to beg for them to Oh, please YouTube, IP,
take all of our information, take a metadata, please let me
change the URL, just I'll throw it into a channel. I'll throw it
into a channel. I don't need your thinking RSS ingestion.
Just let me have a channel. And then boom, I'll add those links
into my feed.
Dave Jones: That don't see why that wouldn't work. As a matter
of fact, we should test it.
Adam Curry: I would like to test it. Steven Be programming
already
Dave Jones: done, sir. He's
Adam Curry: already got it done yet. Steven B
Dave Jones: is what he beats. Yes. I think it's I think it's
worth I think it's worth looking at it because it'd be flip it
around. us use the use the free host. Hey, why not?
Adam Curry: I just see, Justin, you can get the benefit of
YouTube. You know, there's definite benefits to YouTube if
you like it. If you want to play the YouTube game, that's fine.
And then you put right there and every single one of your
descriptions. Subscribe to us on a podcast app. Yeah, did you
find did you find us on YouTube, click here to you know, to
subscribe in pod verse. Click here to subscribe and curio
Kassar, et cetera, et cetera. And then it just you just did
just takes you to the index or whatever, or whatever, however
you do that. You type it into your app, boom, there it is
subscribed done. I don't think people are gonna cry that will
have to click on this YouTube video. That's perfect.
Dave Jones: You go one step further, you can say like an a
podcast host. Sign up for a podcast hosting. And next a,
Adam Curry: where's your where's your YouTube channel?
Dave Jones: When I'm at the YouTube channel, they suck. They
suck in the content, convert it to mp3, and now you're in. Now
you're Native.
Adam Curry: All kinds of things can be done here. But we're
looking at the one wrong way. They need us more than we need
them.
Dave Jones: That like that is yes. And they know it.
Adam Curry: They know it. They'd love to have the dedicated
podcast listeners and viewers. They love it. Why not? They we
give them free audience instead of how can we please be a part
of your audience and recommendation engine? Hey, you
know what, I'm gonna let you enjoy my audience for free. I'm
not going to charge you YouTube for free. It
Dave Jones: struck me the other day that I think I finally
figured out this whole what is a podcast, you know, debate? I
mean, the I mean, we're obviously we know what a podcast
is. On a technical level. It's the notes. It's an enclosure in
an RSS feed. But that's the on a purely technical level. But I
think I've finally figured out what the confusion is amongst
the general public. To, to the average person. A podcast is, is
some people talking to each other? And microphones with
headphones?
Adam Curry: Yes. Yes. That's the podcast. CO
Dave Jones: Vaughn show is is hot cast. Yes. Not because of
anything other than the fact that he has headphones on and
he's talking to somebody into a mic. God, what I'm what, that's
what it is. I would love
Adam Curry: for him to say, yeah, subscribe to the YouTube
channel or wherever you get your podcasts. Seriously? Yeah.
Dave Jones: Everything people are wearing headphones and mics
that are connected. They do things because they want to be a
podcast.
Adam Curry: Oh, yeah. There's lots of people do fake like a
fake podcast setting to make it look like they're serious about
something or they're important because they were interested in
a podcast is just fake. It's not even a real podcast is the names
of those. When
Dave Jones: you say where do you listen to your podcasts? It's
not people are think they think in their head. Okay, what
podcast or listen to? Oh, yeah, here's in a, they think about
all the shows where there's people talking into microphones
with headphones on. And they're like, I think I see a lot of
that on on YouTube. Yeah, YouTube. That's what it is.
Like, there's no, there's lots of things that are podcasts like
NPR shows. Those are those are podcasts. Yes. Yeah. But they
don't have they don't have people talking into microphones
with headphones on. You can't see it can't it's not a part.
Yeah. Exactly. Because I think and I think Joe Rogan is the
reason for that. Yeah, Joe Rogan is the reason people associate
mint Really? Yes, dudes talking into microphones with headphones
on with podcasts.
Adam Curry: Yeah, I mean, I'd like to I'd like to work on
this. I think this would be fantastic. I mean, we were going
to this whole exercise which is kind of funny in a way. This
whole exercise with Ainsley Costello and just loud. And I'm,
by the way, I love you Dolby Das, I love you, blueberry, you
guys are my heroes, for the first time in my life. And I've
been doing this for 30 years, that I don't have to be involved
in getting something set up at a venue and people get me
explaining to people how things work and RSS feeds. They're
sending all this emotion that was a lot of Mao information, I
guess is the right term, some view about how this works and
how the podcasting 2.0 part of streaming SATs works. And there
was I was just praying that whole please can we get this set
up? So the apps that do video can actually do video, and
stream SATs and take booster grams, I was just praying and
these guys jumped in blueberries on site in Minneapolis. I mean,
my heart, my heart is full that you guys are doing this. I love
that, then, you know there's so much went into finding the right
place to stream I'm like, honestly, me No, this is well,
no, I, I disagree with using YouTube. I like using peer tube.
But if you just want to stream it on YouTube, that should be
totally possible in the lit environment. It's totally
possible. Just put the YouTube link and here in closure on in
your lit tag. And Bob's your uncle.
Dave Jones: Yeah, it's just that nobody, it's just that everybody
would choke on the HTML
Adam Curry: code because no one's set up for it. Because
they're not set up for it. But I mean, why not? It's just another
enclosure type.
Dave Jones: Yeah, that's where I'm at. I'm in time, I will
Adam Curry: stream video from this show. But from my, from my
Dave Jones: from my hand from my end. That is boy, no, you're not
going to do that. If if
Adam Curry: a podcast app sets up a YouTube Live, you know,
include as an enclosure, I will publish this as an enclosure on
the lit tag. I will have multiple of course, but so that
people can watch me do the show.
Dave Jones: Do I get if this happens? Do I get to criticize
you for being distracted? Of course,
Adam Curry: because the show will suck it will devolve into
it
Dave Jones: will devolve into Rails
Adam Curry: I'm um, it just seems like we're looking at this
the wrong way. We have some religious belief, quote unquote,
religious belief that it has to be a downloadable thing. No, it
doesn't. It doesn't it
Dave Jones: won't mean especially not for live. I mean,
that's, that's never downloadable. Anyway, some of
Adam Curry: the biggest companies and organizations in
the world use YouTube as their video provider. And they embed
videos all over their site for their conferences, all this
stuff all the time.
Dave Jones: Now I will get religious on it. I will get sort
of religious on the downloadable part because I fight a lot with
streaming. Some there's some aspect of my life where I walk
through stairwells and elevator elevator elevators and I go in
and out of Wi Fi range to such a such a degree that apps the
stream only and don't download just they just fall down all the
time, and it's very aggravated. Sure. So the downloadable part
to me is pretty
Adam Curry: important. But that okay, but are you actually
watching in the elevator? Or are you listening in the elevator
listening use the use the mp3 stream, the mp3 feed? If that's
is that simple, more use the alternative feed whatever,
whatever, whatever the app goes with. I'm with you mean doesn't
happen very often to me, in fact, very infrequently Do I Do
I have an interruption in my stream? Because I'm an older guy
now. So sometimes the stream is interrupted.
Dave Jones: You need medic medication.
Adam Curry: Back to Pfizer blue. It's it just Oh, that's
interesting. Ice Cube soup says this opens up the possibility to
adding value for value to live Twitch streams. Yes. More even
X. I mean, you still get what you pay for. Let's be honest
about it. You can be deep platformed you can be all kinds
of bad stuff can happen to you. But why fight it? It's there.
It's free. These guys literally want you to use it. Or why
shouldn't I have an embedded dip? I don't think Twitter
doesn't beds. But, you know, like, it's crazy not to do it,
put it in the podcast app. I mean, think about what you can
add as an as an audience. I think as an app developer, I
think you can add a lot of a lot of content a lot of users, I
really do. And, you know, we just run our value for value
right alongside with that.
Dave Jones: Well, Soundhound already does this. Do you know
that Soundhound No, I don't think yes. Sound sound Hound is
the app that I think started this whole thing of being able
to you open the app, tap the listen button, and it hears the
song and tells you which one what it is. Oh,
Adam Curry: yeah, yeah. Yeah, of course. I know. This. I'm
looking at now. Yes. Yeah.
Dave Jones: So the Soundhound does this already. It? It will.
It'll tell you what the song is. And they'll say do you want to
listen to it? Play in it plays the YouTube version of the song
in the in their app as an as an embed. There you go. So clearly,
these these small these embeddable web views are
possible. Yes. I think this as an alternate enclosure. Yeah.
Adam Curry: Yeah. In fact, ultimate enclosure, perfect
weight and perfect way to test it.
Dave Jones: Yeah, yeah. All right. And then you just have
the right you have the right to a man type. And then we can be
we'll be done by the end of the day,
Adam Curry: and then solve the biggest problem. Yeah, YouTube,
the other podcast, as long as it's in my podcast app. So what
is a podcast? Something that shows up in my podcast app?
Dave Jones: There's your Yes. There's your Yeah, that's the
answer. That's the answer. So YouTube. Yeah. As a YouTube
video, some shows up on YouTube. A podcast is something shows up
in my podcasts Exactly.
Adam Curry: solves that problem.
Dave Jones: I mean, it let's, let's face reality here. But,
you know, I think we timed the podcast, podcast index. Well, I
Adam Curry: mean, obviously, that was us. was,
Dave Jones: I think, I think the timing was was was fantastic,
for many reasons. But but one is because it's obviously the
podcast apps are hurting, like, with Castro is shutting down.
Adam Curry: Well, we've we have thrown Castro wasn't using value
for value. Yeah,
Dave Jones: yeah. And the pod podcast app, the podcast, app
space is shrinking. And I think there's clear clearly anything
that can be done to that's what our mandate is, our mandate is
to help podcast apps. And anything that that does, that is
fair game. And I think we're, I mean, that makes a lot of sense.
Because then you got, you know, immediately you have a different
bill. Okay, I want to watch this. There's this. This pot,
you know, this quote unquote, podcast that is on YouTube that
I did, there's no feed for anywhere. I can't find it any on
my podcast app, because it's only on YouTube. Well, now it's
a podcast. Now you can see it in your podcast app. Like a lot
right alongside everything that actually is a podcast. Yeah.
Adam Curry: Been. I should probably go through a few
booster grants because people are responding very, very
passionately. So we'll start with blueberry 11,111 I'm
positively stoked for the just loud and Ainslie show seen a lot
of shows in my time, like this. A lot. This one. This is one of
them getting pumped for guar. I feel a wellspring of joy and
valley brewing. I'll be rebroadcasting the live show
through BTS B 40s. feeds and would encourage other lit
enabled shows to consider the same. Let me see Sam Sethi.
Dave, how can apps download episodes and still say still
takes and still take stream SATs? We won't know how much you
listen to until you reconnect while offline. You may listen to
60 minutes of a podcast but have no money when you reconnect in
your wallet to pay for listening. Well, that
Dave Jones: that's already been solved. Yeah. Because they they
they keep state you know, while you're listening, if stacks
those those transactions up and then the next time you come
online, it batches those things. And since those labs already do
that,
Adam Curry: by the way, Steven B says Sorry, guys. 1234 Or five
sets, um, deer hunting this weekend, maybe next weekend.
Okay, all right, then. Well, I will I'll take a little bit of
venison from you. I'd rather have venison than code this
week. Just even be. Anyway, it seems like something we should
just do. And I agree with you. Our mission is to help podcast
apps. But I think we've done pretty well. So So far, and this
solves the biggest problem. What is a podcast? It's in a podcast
app, what's a podcast app? Here you go. It says podcast app
right on the tin. Alright. And that means you can get all forms
of media in your podcast app. It's episodic, that will be the
fairest thing to say, as long as it's episodic, it's a podcast,
and I can get it in my podcast app. The next thing we discussed
last week, in the Fed ification of the index verification of
podcasting 2.0, we discussed DNS as a possibility for adding guid
and etc, identifiers. To which of course, everybody said the
following. I mentioned that 5000 years ago.
Dave Jones: There was a lot of that.
Adam Curry: A lot of that. Yeah, I know. I got it. You know,
we're not pretending like we invented something here. But you
know, there's a time it's all about timing. I have I have come
up. I invented YouTube. 10 years too early. Okay. So it's not how
it works.
Dave Jones: We all invented lots of things. But
Adam Curry: Alex gates turned me on to something, which I think
you saw as well. Or maybe not. P car. Have you seen P car? PDA?
AR AR?
Dave Jones: Yeah, I saw. I saw that. And I'm struggling to
understand it. Okay,
Adam Curry: well, I got it right away. And it's working perfectly
for me. So, PK, what's the what's the URL? Okay, p k a. r
r.org. I'm gonna put this into the into the chat here. Yes,
Eric PPAP, Cor p car.org. Now, if you know I generated a P car,
and this goes to DHT. So it's distributed hash table, I guess
that's, you know, magic space in that space. So if you Kademlia
is what that is. So if you go to I just pasted my predetermined.
What is that call? What would you call that? Gets the D ID or
get the ID if you paste that in and hit resolve. What does it
show you
Dave Jones: wait and pasting this into a browser? No, it
Adam Curry: was first. Yeah. First you go to app dot p
car.org. Yeah. And then you see what I posted in the post. Copy
that key K colon, and then you go to the resolve tab, you paste
that. Paste it in? And then what is the chewy? Okay. Let's see.
Resistant name and a value pair.
Was it not working? Works for me?
Dave Jones: Did I paste it room? Cause Oh, what is that? Okay.
Well, it does who had technical difficulties on the site? Oh,
oh, it came with Mr. character in the copying out of IRC which
is great.
Adam Curry: It's, it's not high tech. Okay. Yes.
Dave Jones: Why am I getting this weird thing? Okay. What?
Adam Curry: You're going to the resolve tab, right? Yeah.
Dave Jones: Okay, here. Here we go. No agenda podcast. Yeah. And
there's the there's.
Adam Curry: So I mean, that's a very, I can paste that into a
feed. And that is now my unique ID for the no agenda podcast.
This is DNS is exactly the same thing. Okay,
Dave Jones: the part I was struggling to understand. Yeah,
the part I was struggling to understand is the D Kademlia.
Part, the DHT space. Because that fits in, like, what this is
fits in? Well, because we're the vision that we had is is a DHTs
space for the index. So I mean, this this, and we're using live
p2p. Yes.
Adam Curry: And it has it runs on relays. So you know,
obviously we need to we need to have relays but
Dave Jones: Well, I think the relays if I'm the the length
that I got to with my understanding of this of of
Kademlia was that the relay is that that is the DHT space that
bit torrent nodes use. So I think, Okay, this is the this is
the part I did not understand is I don't know if that means that
all Bit Torrent nodes would be inherent P core compatible
nodes.
Adam Curry: This I don't know, but I have no
Dave Jones: that's where I that's where I got lost is
because it's the same. It's the same protocol. So it's, it's
possible that The Bitcoin that sound the Bitcoin, the
BitTorrent network is, is an a, you know, like, this is an
overlay on top of that. And if that's the case, then I mean,
that's a robust thing.
Adam Curry: I think it's someone's, please stop DMing me
on IRC. When people do that, it's, it looks very robust. And
if it comes from Alice gates, it's already pre approved. Yeah,
Dave Jones: right, it comes with the seal. And
Adam Curry: you can add record, you can add multiple records
into your key. So you can have all kinds of interesting stuff
in there. And then anybody can run a deep this DHT relay.
Clearly, it's working. They do have a caveat here that says,
you need to republish your records every hour or so
otherwise, there'll be dropped from DHT. While I haven't
republished anything, and it's still working after several
days, so I'm not sure about that part of it. But it's not like
that couldn't be couldn't be done. Now that we can't figure
that part out. So it just seemed like, Wow, what a beautiful way
to have a distributed podcast DNS for all of that stuff that
we've been talking about.
Dave Jones: For sure. I really need to know where the nodes
are. Because if we have to bootstrap these nodes, that's a
diff. It's not a it's not a deal killer. It's just that we like
that's a pretty big thing to know. C says native native
application can directly query and verify signatures signed
records from DHT from the DHT. If they are not behind Nat, was
check
Adam Curry: this out existing applications on aware of P car,
make normal DNS queries over HTTPS to P car servers. Whoa,
whoa,
Dave Jones: this is P car, we'll use mainline DHT as the Overlay
Network. Specifically bid 44 for storing femoral arbitrary data.
44
Adam Curry: Oh my God, that's great. What does it mean?
Dave Jones: That's your favorite bit. Of
Adam Curry: all the BEPS 44 is the one that just tickles me
pink. Yeah,
Dave Jones: cuz here's this is mainline DHT is the name given
to the Kademlia based can distributed hash table used by
Bit Torrent clients to find peers via the BitTorrent
protocol. It's
Adam Curry: a bit torn out is the BitTorrent hash base. You're
right. Yeah. So
Dave Jones: I guess that's, that's really my question is I
need to figure out if that means that these that that's where
this, these if that's where all this these key value pairs are
being stored? Yes,
Adam Curry: I think so. It looks like it. Okay. Yes. It's, it
refers to bet five. She remember that one. Okay.
Dave Jones: Everybody remembers that? She was crazy.
Adam Curry: That five min good times with bet five days.
Dave Jones: That chick was nuts.
Adam Curry: Remember, she told us about BEP? Six? Oh,
Dave Jones: that's right. Eric. off the hook. Yeah, no, this is
this is good. This is this is good. Because we writing
Adam Curry: this guy has gotten me excited when I was able to do
this myself on a web page, like Okay, I just created this, I
just basically created a whole podcast DNS record, which can be
referenced over DNS for a non for non BEP, 44. Client,
whatever that means.
Dave Jones: When so whatever happened with with the IPFS
streaming, that that was falling down the last time.
Adam Curry: Now I'm still on IPFS.
Dave Jones: We had that there. Were there. There were hiccups.
There
Adam Curry: were issues. Yes. It was course was a core issue that
was introduced, then it was at was about thought a lot about
IPFS podcasting.net, which I still use. It no longer has that
long delay before it starts it there is a little bit of a
delay. Been maybe a couple seconds sometimes depending on,
you know how many nodes etc. It works fine. The weakness, of
course, is IPFS podcasting. dotnet no offense, Cameron. If
that goes down, the whole thing falls apart.
Dave Jones: Sure. So because that's the router.
Adam Curry: That's the I mean, and I still admit, obviously, it
seems to be difficult for apps to implement for IPFS nodes in
their apps. So we're using gateways. Right now. All IPFS
podcasting dotnet goes through a gateway that I pay for, which is
fine. That's
Dave Jones: what rss.com was. Was
Adam Curry: there. Maybe they may be doing some round robin.
Yes. I
Dave Jones: think Alberto was was right. Yes. Yeah. Big node.
Yeah, but
Adam Curry: at least it's not going through ipfs.io Oh
anymore, that's the main thing. So, and boy, I'll tell you how
many emails I now I'm starting to notice, like, I'll hover over
the link that they want me to click some, some, some kind of
spam stuff and right there ipfs.io Now this is used for all
kinds of nefarious stuff. So on our gateway only podcasts work
only those MIME types, you know, so that's, that's the Mark did a
great job on that.
Dave Jones: It was a wish mark, it would be great. If Mark could
write up what he did. He
Adam Curry: actually has written it up, I just got to ask him to
publish it somewhere. I've seen a write up be posted some stuff
on social about it.
Dave Jones: Because we yeah, we I would love to see what his
what his final architecture was. And so that it could just be
sort of wrapped up and replicated to who else would
wants to run it? Sure. Yeah. Cuz because that I mean, ultimately,
the if we, if we push into this to this DHT idea, that could
also you know, function in that way. I mean, you you could the
the enclosures themselves could be also, you know, references to
a specific gateway or whatever. And you would lessen the, the
dependence on IVF you know, DFS podcasting.
Adam Curry: So this DHT over DNS is sexy stuff. Sexy? Yeah. So
you can resolve one of these PK DHT keys over a DNS query.
That's Han. Poking, we need to dive it I mean, this obviously
unit, you need to take a look at this, you need to think about it
and I'm sure Alex gates will have all kinds of ideas, but it
just seemed like this is a great way to start fortifying a lot of
stuff to start being able to push some of those main things
that we don't want to be the resolver for such as Gu IDs, you
know, person identifiers, etc, etc. It seems like this is
really robust. Like it's been, you know, the BitTorrent stuff
has been around for a long time.
Dave Jones: Yeah, it has Yeah, this says this must be the case
because it says this 10 million node DHT with a 15 year track
record. Yeah, that's exactly it. Nothing else would come close to
that I wanted to not be
Adam Curry: and you know, add DNS on top of that, which has a
lot of, you know, assuredness as to validity is beautiful.
Dave Jones: Yeah, like that. Yeah, I like that a lot. I
wonder. And he's trying to get Alex back on. Talk about no rim
brainstorm some stuff. Yeah. I'm not doing my job as a booker
very well, no,
Adam Curry: no, you suck. You're terrible, sir. No. And by the
way, I wanted to mention that Andrew Gromit has now the Andrew
grommet is putting together all this progressive web app stuff
on his GitHub and he posts about it on on podcast index dot
social, this it he's building this kind of like as a fallback
for when it all goes to crap and the apps are no longer possible.
And he's it's pretty impressive what he's building. He's putting
together a whole bunch of libraries got IPFS alternative
closure, not put into it, that he's resolved a lot of the
progressive webapp issues. So if you're looking for it, Andrew
Grumman has got it going on. He's kind of our, you know, he's
like our ripcord. He's he's building
Dave Jones: it break glass, break
Adam Curry: break glass in case of emergency. I really
appreciate that. And you saw the orbit DB stuff, right? I'm just
bringing I did yeah. Yeah, I did. So that's that is that may
be something viable to distribute the whole index? It's
Dave Jones: it's possible, as I say that usually the issue with
most of those distributed databases is that they are, like
it said, eventually consistent, which is basically all no SQL
databases are eventually consistent as well. That's not
that's not something that we could just shift the database to
know that we re architected to live on that. Yeah, because
eventual consistence negates the possibility of having a table
relationships. Because the relationships break. Like you
can't have a four, you can't have a foreign key if the remote
value doesn't exist. So that's it's just a re architecture that
would have to happen. And I'm not I'm definitely not opposed
to doing that at all. Oh,
Adam Curry: we got I think we have other stuff to do first.
Well, I
Dave Jones: think the hold back on that would be we would need
to architecture that based on what the interface would be. So
if the interface is going to be DHT or something like something
along those lines. Because, okay, once you do that, here's
what I'm trying to say. Once you do that you have to have you've
essentially entered the same problem space as IPFS. Right,
you now need you need a you need a gateway into that thing. So
the gateway, is it going to be HTTP? I mean, the best probably
you need that. So we'll use, we'd have to have gateways,
essentially, you know, you have our gateway nodes to get into
whatever this thing is. It's no longer is no longer a machine
running, running a SQL database, and AST and an API and HTTP
front end, it's now it's now a hash. A big flat file. Yeah,
it's, it's now DNS servers. You need about you know, you need to
be you need to you need to get entry points, gateways into this
thing. Right. So I think once we figured, you know, well, I mean,
I guess we kind of know that already. I guess, we know at
least it's got to be HTTP. Then you got to figure out who can
write to it.
Adam Curry: Right? That's Yes. That's, that's the big one.
Yeah.
Dave Jones: Because it mean, well, you if you.
Adam Curry: So we built this whole distributed architecture,
and Dave still runs it. Yeah, that's what I want to not do.
Keep drinking those beef milkshakes. We got to keep Dave
alai que da keep Dave alive.
Dave Jones: That's, that's what I Yeah, that's what I want to
not do. Because I think we all want to get away from that.
Yeah. Well, as
Adam Curry: if to restate kind of the mission that we're on,
you know, we have given independent podcast apps a place
to feed on to live from that. And I feel really good about
that. If you're solid, we have a little bit of money in the bank
to keep it running. If everything falls down, and B
we've got code distributed database distributed. We're
still a vulnerability in the whole mix, obviously. And it'll
take some years, but I feels good. David feels like we're
moving in the right direction on all of this, you know, that
thinks mainly because, you know, we're not in this to exit you
know, we're not looking for an exit here with the exit we want
is to not exist. You know, we want a real exit. It's a true
exit.
Dave Jones: And our exit is rest. Yes. Well, for you, man.
for you today. Now. Yeah,
Adam Curry: for you mainly well.
Dave Jones: So that's, that's something we need to discuss
real quick. I mean, I know we're, we're getting on in the
show now. But like we need to talk about Elon pay. Oh, yeah.
Go for him. Yeah, Tim. People may not know this, but we've
been right running an LM pay node to support like, you know,
what you might call legacy wallets for a while we've been
paying for it. Yeah, we pay a lot. I mean, we pay $450 a month
for him to for Tim case, hosting fees to run this node for us.
And Tim basically doesn't make anything off of enemy. He's
just, this is all this is all basically charity work for him
and us. And just to support the, you know,
Adam Curry: the value for value, what we bootstrapped was a
bootstrap. Yeah.
Dave Jones: So we went from sphinx to Ellen pay in the
beginning. Lm pays node had problems. And Tim said, you
know, hey, there's a lot of traffic coming through this
thing, y'all. Y'all are killing it on the on the podcasting 2.0
stuff. So really, we need to split this off into a separate
node. So we were like, Yeah, sure, you know, we'll pay for
that. We started paying him to run a node dedicated just to
podcasting 2.0 stuff. And it hosted, you know, hosted a bunch
of wallets. But those slowly got moved as everybody moved to
Albie, and to fountain and other solutions. So that that LNP node
is pretty much defunct now, there hasn't been any
transactions on that node for like, at least a month or more.
So he contacted us and say, Hey, I'm really getting ready to shut
this thing down into the year 2023 I want to be out of this
game because, you know, it's a risk for him. I mean, he doesn't
know what's going on on this thing. He was all just for him.
It was all just fun. A side project for monetizing
Adam Curry: it for us it was just bootstrapping and we're
happy to be out of the game for sure.
Dave Jones: And he decided that he's like you know what I'm this
is not never going to be a moneymaker for me and I don't
really want it to be anyway, so I'm just gonna get out so he's
gonna shut the whole thing down. So that means 1231 Let's just
you know, roughly into the year the Ellen pay stuff is
completely gone. It's shutting the whole thing down is good for
us because that means that we don't have to pay that bill
every month that'll that'll help save us some money. And that but
anyway, the if anybody's still has If you if you have something
on LMP you already know that that's probably redundant but if
if you have like a forecast ematic I think cast Matic still
has like a migration function that works where you can move
your wallet from ln pay to Alby into the year that's that's just
all going to go away as now's the time.
Adam Curry: And I just wanted to say and I know he doesn't mind
me saying it just so you know how value for value works with
with the value split? Neal Jones to people listen, no agenda
known as the clip custodian. He has been supplying me with clips
for um, it may be it may be running on two years. Now how
long is how long is Emily's? No,
Dave Jones: it's, it's longer than that. It's longer than
that. And he's doing it before we started.
Adam Curry: Yeah, that's true. And so once we add value for
value up and running, then this is pretty much what no agenda
gives all of their SATs away. The I said, Dude, I'm putting in
for them. See, it was it was initially 5%. Now I'm thinking
Let me let me check. I can look it up. I'm gonna look it up. You
know, I'm gonna let you out a lot. Look it up. I'm looking it
up. Let me I just looked it up. looking it up. And he's in for
oh, 20% Yeah. 20. But I upped that it was it was 10%. And then
somewhere along the line it upset. That mean, he had like 8
million sets.
Dave Jones: They did this. Just so you know.
Adam Curry: That's that's that's actual money. It's like three
grand, right? Yeah, it was actual money that had just been
accruing. And I'd switch them over to Albie a while ago. So
this, you know, it stopped. But it was just sitting there. And
it was so many basically by how we even do can't even move in
that over the Lightning Network. Like if he so Tim sends it to
them on chain. But there's real money yo.
Dave Jones: Well, let me look at 30 Look at look at V four v
stats.com. I mean, it's we're still tracking daily stuff. And
over the last 90 days $38,278 have changed hands. Yeah.
Adam Curry: So is real money going around this network. Real
money to value for value, even with the Satoshis is doing
something real. I'm so proud of us. No one owns it. No one No
one can interrupt it. No one owns it. That's the beauty. Peer
to Peer money. In that's why you do
Dave Jones: that's why you do things in the most open way
possible is because that's that's how you achieve
resilience.
Adam Curry: We love it. We love it. Alright, let's thank some
people. Dave Jones. I'm gonna go through some of these live
boosts that we've gotten. Steven B 12345. We did the blueberry
11,000 1100 Sam Sethi with 1000 We got that one nice row of
ducks. 22,222 from hard hat. And he says your ad here. Sure, put
22,000 SATs you can 10,000 from Sam Sethi my time and attention
has value. Today advertisers give me no value for my time and
attention. They want it for free. Using V for free
advertisers could pay me SATs per minute to listen to adverts,
aka reverse wallet switching. If I skipped forward they stopped
paying but if I listened they pay podcasters can take a split
for serving the advert to their listeners that this has always
been. We've always talked about this being a possibility. And of
course, it makes nothing but sense. By the way, I wanted to
mention Dolby das came up with an interesting new term which I
thought would be worth mentioning. You know Dolby dasa
says RSS blue.com. And they have valued time splits, also known
as magic wallet switching technology. And the way he sets
it up, is he the he does it with chapters. So when you're playing
a song, or have another person come on, you set a chapter
marker and that chapter marker under the hood, that creates the
wallet switch to the remote and back and he calls that super
chapters and I like it. I like to buy like super chapters
because the Super Chat so the chapter marker becomes your
value time split marker that may not be appropriate for
everybody. But in general, I think that's pretty good. I
think it's pretty good. I like it.
Dave Jones: I get Yeah, it's it's some Yeah, I can see it.
It's from some people. Yeah, it's just another option. Yes.
Yeah, it just
Adam Curry: it sounds cool. But what are you super chapters? Oh,
that's where the wallet switches? Yeah, super chapters.
Exactly. We have served Ryan in London 21,948 or 219 48 Israeli
freedom boost brother you're in our prayers ceasefire over back
under rocket fire he says and he's of course is in Israel and
so your prayers are with you brother so stupid stupid stupid
wars so stupid we need to make peace profitable again that's
how we'll stop this stuff.
Dave Jones: Amen
Adam Curry: We have so let me see 33 over 10 Boys sends us
SATs from breeze 12345 Spaceballs boost face balls.
What is face balls come up?
Dave Jones: I don't know is that something we talked it must have
been I know. That sounds familiar. Yeah.
Adam Curry: One on One SATs from Sam sathyu says can't let this
was some discrepancy we talked about he says I can't listen to
you live at the time. 6:25am local time. But I mean I set it
to 1225 Looks good. See? Ya look good look. But we have let me
see. That's it. That's it for our booths were current. So you
can take it away from what you've got from your now fixed
system. Yes,
Dave Jones: we are receiving emails again. We've got no one
off donations from PayPal this week. So straight to booster
grams. We go we start with chyron 2222 from the mere
mortals podcast or curio kasseri says
Adam Curry: sorry, I hit the dock I hit the dock
Dave Jones: I was frozen waiting for this. So a couple of pain
points I've personally had recently if I switch to using if
I switch from using something like contracts to fountain and
soon pod fans for providing my value blog info, how does the
index know which to use if I ever want to move a show like
mere mortals which has lots of different episodes splits from
Buzzsprout to a host that supports the value tag I need a
way to direct them to the feed with all the add ons. So a
general export or linkage from the PI feed would be useful so
that's that's an easy one if you just to if you switch away from
a host that doesn't support a value block to a host that does
then that value block will go into the feed and we will see
that value block and will override everything yeah and all
it will suck all that in
Adam Curry: so Barry is this way he says switching from contracts
to something else? I mean yeah, just you change it in the feed
and the N and the index sees it and changes it right? Yeah,
Dave Jones: like if you if you're paying if you're giving
contracts a split to get their stats then you just switch that
to the other person Yeah,
Adam Curry: it's you're in control. You rock you rock you
roll you rule the man's you chyron you go by
Dave Jones: as a Mary Oh Mary Oscar also known as Oscar Mary
7333 through found and he says P Doom equals zero Happy
Thanksgiving.
Adam Curry: Thank you. Thank you Oscar. fountain
Dave Jones: with a P doom of 01111. From Joel W. Through
fountain says roosters lives matter let's get a link here I
don't know was that a link to oh that's a clip that's a found
clip oh wait that didn't go where I thought it would wait I
may have to investigate this clip. I thought it was just a
clip of us Oh, I don't know what that is. If I didn't know what
that was I would I started to bring that next week. That's it
linked to a different show where they're talking about roosters
are some bad career advice Chad 6969 through found a nice a
super awesome Turkey Day episode started strong with chicken gore
and ended with TLD to have that will become podcasting lower.
Adam Curry: It will become podcasting. Well Phoebe's all
upset on what she's upset about right now.
Dave Jones: In the morning, 1200 SATs through fountain says Dave
stop beating those cogs. Okay. I knew somebody was going to do
it. It wasn't inevitable. Yes, of course. There was an
incoming. Okay. Jason from podcast Guru 22 to 22 through
podcasts guru, of course. He says thanks for helping us out
on X Twitter. Users don't often understand how podcast ads work.
Oh, yeah. He got the typical
Adam Curry: Yeah, oh, I installed podcast guru which you
told me to install curry. I got ads pharma ads. And this is what
podcasting 2.0 is all about. And here's the thing though, this
some podcasts and I said well, no, that's, you know, that's the
podcast, who you know, they're the ones who have a deal with
the ad insertion. And these and the podcast got In my face,
they're like, Well, you don't understand us. We'd never want
pharma ads. That's our host. Oh, okay. So
Dave Jones: they're just passing the buck upstream. Yeah. All the
way you
Adam Curry: know, because we've told them time and again, we
don't want pharma ads and we need to make sure that just
because you don't understand who we are like, dude, slow down.
Why are you so mad bro?
Dave Jones: They will never, ever respect what the podcaster
wants no advertiser. Oh, of course he could care less. And
once you get what you get, and was
Adam Curry: it Megatron or who are those guys? megaphone?
Dave Jones: Megatron. Megatron. Megatron, that's probably more
appropriate. Yeah, Mike Dell 1701 Star Trek boost. He says
tell Andrew to call Mike and blueberry to get off the
Feedburner
Adam Curry: Oh, that's Andrew Horowitz Yeah. Okay, yeah, I'll
remember next time because I get called Micah blue. I think he
actually I think he might have talked to me. I don't know it's
it's he's in the in the Feedburner hole just like good
luck.
Dave Jones: Yeah, call Mike D. Brian Ensminger 1701. Another
Star Trek boost. Their cast thematic says AI chat bots are
the new Clippy That's right. There the old clip he actually
yes. That's it. That's it. We got some. We because we have no
commentary blogger because he's taking the Yeah,
Adam Curry: he's taking the month off to study on his AI
test.
Dave Jones: We do have some monthlies. We have Michael
Kimmerer $5.33, dribs got the Bruce Wayne of podcasting. $15
Pedro gun calvess $5. Chad, Pharaoh $20.22, Scott Jobert
$12. And Cameron Rose $25. And that's our group, small group.
But a solid group.
Adam Curry: Thank you all so much, we appreciate you this is
it is value for value. That is, that's how we keep this all
running. If the show or the project or anything gives you
any value of any sort, maybe we know that the hosting companies
value it and we know the apps value it and podcast, you should
value it. If you do then you can go to podcast index.org. Down at
the bottom, we've got two red donate buttons. One is for your
Fiat fund coupons. You can do it through PayPal, which is still
like completely valid way of doing it. And we have unchained
I should probably check that to make sure that although that
doesn't happen very it's all usually only Dred Scott, if
there's anything on the on chain, and Nope, there's nothing
there. Or you can go to podcast apps.com Which I believe is Dame
Jennifer registered modern podcast apps.com For us, which I
appreciate. Yeah, that's cool. And get one of those modern
podcast apps and boost us we love the boosts we love the
booster grams. It keeps all the servers running, keeps
everything going and let you know that you value what we're
doing here. And we really appreciate that. Thank you so
much.
Dave Jones: That was evidently in response to a miss, like a
misspeak. But you know, I think where you said modern podcast
apps.com. This, this is this happened to my wife. They miss
me she had me or she does illustrations for lots of
things. But she had illustration for one of her children's books
that was published, and the publisher misquoted, they
spelled her website wrong in two different places. So I had to go
read I was had to defensively register those wrong domain
names.
Adam Curry: Oh, and redirect them to the right, right. Oh,
worse. That's the worst.
Dave Jones: Three domain names that I'm pointing to for like
the net for the rest of my life that I'm paying for every year.
Only for defense. Oh, yeah. Tell
Adam Curry: me about it. I have several of those domain names
that will stay with me forever. For reasons like that. Yeah. All
right, brother. Anything else for the roundtable? Before we
before we made a joke, everyone.
Dave Jones: Now I'm good at that. I got I got homework to do
this weekend on Olympic car.
Adam Curry: Yeah, it's, it's, I just got excited by it. Because
I just I register a lot of domain names or have in my life.
And when I see I'm just adding records, click click click I'm
done with this is cool. This is easier than than my registrar.
This is just felt very cool. I love it a lot. Could be good. I
Dave Jones: think. Hopefully we'll have questions answered by
next week. And we can actually we can actually like do a
feasibility discussion on how like, what not Oh, that's cool,
but
Adam Curry: a little deeper. All right, Alex gates on deck as
well. All right, brother. Have yourself a great weekend. And
we'll be talking next week. All right, man. All right. Thank you
all very much there in the chat room. We appreciate you joining
us here for the board meeting podcast. Lesson 2.0 Join us next
Friday right here podcasting.
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